General Discussion related to the Plazma Burst game series.


Postby king4k » 17 March 2020, 17:40

Thank you all of your guys for discussing about this issue, and I wanna add more two cents about the TACTIC part as a part of people don’t have a deeper thought in it.

The new netcode itself isn’t totally a bad netcode, it may works even better, but only in the assumption of the widespread of the servers.

I’ll take this video as an example:

Everyone uses Pre-aim or percussion to kill others in the old server, this is because in that kind of hit detection in the server, this tactic enables everyone to play in a same standard, which is fair. Whereas the new server, where the hit detection lies in the local, produces lots of various standards, which are exaggerated badly due to the latency and results the kills by random.

The hit detection in the local has led to another issue which is player movements. Due to the ping, players send their movement info to the server in an such interrupted way, which directly gives rise to the interrupted movement (ie. Teleport on your screen). For one thing, players will be likely to see others who are doing self-boast or sth in a fast movement flashing in the moment. Not only that, the server can make false response due to the ping issue. For instance, when X jumps from A to B, the movement info is sent to the server but slowed by the ping, in this moment, Y sees X still lies in A, and then gives a shot to A and hit, the local immediately gives an hit info to the server and then causes X’s death while in X only sees he/she was killed by nothing. We can see the mistaken judge makes one side feel seemingly fair play, meanwhile the other side is confusing play. This is why many players, especially top players are disappointed with the game and left.

When I’m writing this article, it's not just for my sake, but I noticed a plenty of players who have witnessed the rise and fall of pb2, from 2012 to 2020, who plays day and night and got ten thousands of kills, who still wanna make pb2 great again, feel disappointed. I firmly appeal that the MP could go back to the one in the version 1.23, which is the most ideal version agreed by most of the top players.

It is those small but not crucial bugs that makes PB2 interesting, fixing them does not always mean a step forward. Correspondingly, by bring back one of the versions, does not mean the step back, but making the game better.
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Postby Star Fox McCloud » 17 March 2020, 19:26

I can’t play like I used to anymore, all my ways, illusions of gameplay are completely gone and it isn’t fun anymore. For good.

Pfft could have reversed the way things worked, and have the new multiplayer be the one needing to be unlocked by doing campaign

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Postby TheMeteor » 18 March 2020, 20:25

Im currently 14 yo and i play this game since 8 years (Yes, i literally learn english in this game and not in school lol)
I quit playing this since the new netcode was implemented and my internet provider was downgraded..
I still play this game somedays like a guest)
but i dont want to play in a game that i dont like anymore
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Postby mrblake213 » 26 March 2020, 14:21

Here's a compilation of what Eric has said about this Old vs New netcode issue.

Spoiler: Show More

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Postby Star Fox McCloud » 26 March 2020, 15:34

Not sure what to say but... I just see players not knowing what they are doing and just mashing buttons including me in one shot maps. For new players, they see bullets go through them, and then dying by nothing at all. Then leave the game. I saw a lagging player 4 days ago, thousands of bullets was going through him, his ping was around 300, it took 3 minutes until the body was killed. It seemed like he was teleporting and was on a verge of getting disconnected, but couldn’t. I have never seen that in all the years of playing this game.

Sure it may be better for players with pings below 60 with good computers, but how many players have that in the current game? And they need to play only with each other for good gameplay. Which 98% of the California/EU servers barely has all the time. So... again this is a benefit to the lowest pinger with great devices, while the whole majority get weeded out? Like from 2013 but worse?

Just to add, does the separation between old mp and new mp cause the population to be far lower on one end?

Did the players who played for years vote yes because they were in the excitement MOSTLY for the whole update as a whole with the fan art updates? And overlooked the netcode all by itself? Or simply just because the functionality of the weapons worked far better in terms of shooting, although the collision/hitboxes are very terrible?

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Postby chaos dragon » 27 March 2020, 14:22

Has it really gone to this point? To be honest i like the effort and the stuff you'd spent on this topic, Appreciated that, I don't really had much problem with the new netcode at all, However it bothers me when the bullet doesn't hit me but it kills me, I'm not sure if it does affects ping by the game's speed, Fair enough that this is a controversial topic, I also don't think the old multiplayer is used a lot its utterly dead because you have to complete 42 levels for that if i remember correctly.

Girl_Power wrote:Couldn't agree more. I appreciate the information and such but honestly, no one is ever going to read all of it.

Regarding your shitty statement, That didn't age well. You just think everything is not experienced to stuff such as this.

Assassian4 wrote:staff team bad, well not all of them. Mainly wasted time because of the whole thing about banning 5 people from the discord without reason.

That has nothing to do about this topic, I hope you learned your lesson, And there is a reason why he did that, Now he is calm. Oh wait, Didn't you got muted by Tempus for 14 days for still being the same after you got unbanned? Oh shame.

In the meanwhile, I think the old netcode is more fair imo.
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Postby yi en » 24 April 2020, 12:32

I would like to throw some 2 cents upon this one.

Credit to Pixelbyte for the footage.

Based on the video, please rethink about the new netcode.

Basically by judging with psychological feedback on the hit register, it is undeniable that both of the netcode method sucks. But if we had to pick one of them during PvP, I am assuredly sure that old netcode could bring less negative impact. Let's make a virtual situation:

Would you prefer your bullet seems hit somebody but nobody happens, or your bullet really hit somebody, then someone's body will "resurrect" and kills you then? Keep the answer to yourself, I don't need your answer.

In psychological methods of gaming purpose, both old and new netcodes are working as:
Old netcode: graphically seems your bullet had hit someone -> but someone is not died and act like nothing -> 50% of chance you would tell yourself you didn't hit him meanwhile another 50% of chance you are "sure" that you really hit him.
New netcode: graphically seems your bullet had hit someone -> someone died in your screen. -> 50% of chance you are actually hitting him and scored meanwhile another 50% of chance you are actually not hitting him -> if you are actually not hitting him, that guy will just resurrect like the video had shown.

(not even to mention that you would just died suddenly through the wall by railgun. This may enraged players more and having them rage quit.)

If I had money and chances I would instead bring the game developer to Asian countries to test it out the pain of the reality of new netcode.

Meanwhile, I had to included that the game theory has a wisdom sentence: " If there's a bug which haven't been fixed in few years, it will become a "unlisted feature." From 2012, selfboost and glitch through walls are exist, but since nobody even cares about them, then we would told all players that "selfboost" and "glitch through thin walls" are one of the features in PB2 in 2020. This same applies to old netcode. When all old veterans are used to be, suddenly a switch of new netcode would sadden more old veterans and bring down all the way. If game developer is trying to switching the new blood to replace all the old blood, which ranked PvP old veterans supporters, I have nothing to say.

In the other hand, I would hope that the next year the netcode may probably being changed again, whatever it will be moved in HTML5 or adobe cloud, but one thing I am sure is the netcode will drastically changed again. PB2 had transformed from a free to pay games until a "better ping to win" games, which I would say is harmful in game era.

There's too many examples of the games which died like this, one of the famous examples can clearly describe PB2 PvP changes is CSO in Korea.

CSO in zombie mode once had a "bug" which when you switch the axes and the rifles, it can deal unimaginable and illogical damage to the enemy, which had been 4 years before it was finally fixed. But as the day the server finally fixed that bug, most of the players are angry and left the game. Imagine putting this example into PB2. Even the old netcode are not really a "bug" that affects the game balance (as the starting game environment is there), but changing how the game is played dramatically will be a big no-no to updating the game.

But as we are talking to whole point, does new netcode really useless? I would say not really, but indeed useless in ranked maps.

Look at roleplay games, escape/traps series and parkour series. The new netcode are surely executed better for those other type of maps.

Role play can be more realistic as the new netcode comes in, it would not becoming "bullet hitting player but seems fine", then if we are killing a player in RP, even the player will resurrect shortly, video editing would cut those part out so we are fine to go.

Escape/traps and parkour series would have improved a few, or slightly better advantage for runners.
We could say a trap is flying through the player, by the help of new netcode we can see that how the player escapes/glitches/crushed by the falling door trap better. Parkour series would handle the hitboxes much better, which you won't just suddenly glitched out by entities hitbox and fall to your death.

In a nutshell, those are part of my ideas about the new/old netcode comparison. As I stated before, I stand in old netcode feature and hopefully the old netcode feature will get back to his throne before we would have better ping/ server there, after that we will discuss them again.
UnrealCrash wrote:Game has been updated (slight netcode update that includes some of desynchronization fixes as well as newer hit detection model where player limbs get circular hitbox instead of rectangular while in-between frame states are handled more accurately).

Best. Joke. Ever. 2020.
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Postby mingo1 » 28 April 2020, 06:30

I actually prefer the new netcode. Besides the weird deaths and resurrections that happen at times, I feel rewarded for hitting my shots. It's a bit of a learning curve for older players like myself, but I'm cool with adapting to things.

For a lot of people, they're so used to playing in the old way, and that's okay. Me personally, I don't mind the change and I think it's ultimately better for newer players who will aim directly at their enemies to kill them rather than "anticipate movement" like with the old netcode

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