Common knowledge

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Common knowledge

Postby lpzimm » 17 December 2017, 18:34

Hi all,
So, recently in the forums, especially the map un-approval section, there has been a lot of controversy surrounding the rule that a high physics/no swords player has to be able to access all points of an approved map. The hop with a gun is extremely short, however, and if this rule was acted on I'm afraid at least half of currently approved maps would not pass. I also think following this rule is very limiting to map makers. Right now this rule is being acted on as a sort of attempt at petty revenge.
Since, obviously, this rule was badly constructed, I think we need a list of what common players should know of as movement options. I think this should consist of at least:
- swords make you jump higher and move faster (without slicing)
- wall jumping
And, ideally:
- slicing swords will drag you in that direction.
Now, the first three aren't too controversial. The rule should be changed to at least have sword jumps fair game. The third one however, while controversial, can be evidenced as expected common knowledge by maps like EGRW1.
What are your thoughts?
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Re: Common knowledge

Postby Dariy » 17 December 2017, 20:47

I think the way to work around this problem is to design the "unreachable" parts so that there are actually 2 or more ways to reach them, one is longer & slower and is there only for the "noobs" (reachable while jumping with a weapon) and the other route is the quick one reachable with methods such as self boosting for the better players.
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Re: Common knowledge

Postby Krutz » 18 December 2017, 21:03

it wasnt being used for anything relating to revenge... if you thought about it a little bit harder, youd realize that it was being "used" to prove a point: that the rule itself is stupid

the mobility offered by swords is a mechanic of the game and should be acknowledged by players if they wish to be competitive

no map should be ineligible for approval simply because some spot on it cant be reached by someone jumping with an assault rifle braced, thats just ridiculous

it doesnt take a genius to say that the rule "was badly constructed"

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Re: Common knowledge

Postby mingo1 » 19 December 2017, 00:19

I completely agree that, somehow, your three points should be common knowledge for every new player.
In addition, I feel that self-boosting, straight-up, should be common knowledge.
Please, correct me if I'm wrong, but here's the deal: the campaign serves as a tutorial for new players, but I don't believe the campaign ever explains what low and high physics does to your character. Newer players often ask how older players "jump so high" because the campaign never explains to them how to do so.
Granted, Eric has mentioned how self-boosting is actually a glitch he never planned to have in the game. However, since self-boosting is so common among players as both a combat tactic and a movement strategy, he should add a self-boosting lesson into, if not this campaign, the Plazma Burst 2 sequel's campaign.

Regardless, sword jumps should be fair game for approved maps. Again, self-boosting is too common for Eric, or whoever, to not let sword jumps be fair game.

:D
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Re: Common knowledge

Postby Resurrectionn » 19 December 2017, 01:39

I personally think that maps should be allowed to but places reachable only for the skilled with in reason. Approved is meant to be competitive,
Why shouldn't maps push players to their skill limits, force them to learn new moves and be rewarded by having an advantage while playing ?
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Re: Common knowledge

Postby lpzimm » 19 December 2017, 20:06

Krutz wrote:it wasnt being used for anything relating to revenge... if you thought about it a little bit harder, youd realize that it was being "used" to prove a point: that the rule itself is stupid

Certainly you may have been using it to prove a point, but if you don't think there's any beef going on against stryde on those forums then you underestimate the pettiness of this community.
Krutz wrote:the mobility offered by swords is a mechanic of the game and should be acknowledged by players if they wish to be competitive

no map should be ineligible for approval simply because some spot on it cant be reached by someone jumping with an assault rifle braced, thats just ridiculous

it doesnt take a genius to say that the rule "was badly constructed"

Yeah, that's what I'm saying.

mingo1 wrote:I completely agree that, somehow, your three points should be common knowledge for every new player.
In addition, I feel that self-boosting, straight-up, should be common knowledge.
Please, correct me if I'm wrong, but here's the deal: the campaign serves as a tutorial for new players, but I don't believe the campaign ever explains what low and high physics does to your character. Newer players often ask how older players "jump so high" because the campaign never explains to them how to do so.
Granted, Eric has mentioned how self-boosting is actually a glitch he never planned to have in the game. However, since self-boosting is so common among players as both a combat tactic and a movement strategy, he should add a self-boosting lesson into, if not this campaign, the Plazma Burst 2 sequel's campaign.

Regardless, sword jumps should be fair game for approved maps. Again, self-boosting is too common for Eric, or whoever, to not let sword jumps be fair game.

:D

Yeah, I mean, selfboosting is difficult to do for many players, especially ones on slower machines, so I do think that making areas accessible to only self boosts is a little far. Sword jumps, though, I agree.

Resurrectionn wrote: I personally think that maps should be allowed to but places reachable only for the skilled with in reason. Approved is meant to be competitive,
Why shouldn't maps push players to their skill limits, force them to learn new moves and be rewarded by having an advantage while playing ?

Yeah, Max Teabag said more-or-less the same thing. I agree.

Dariy wrote:I think the way to work around this problem is to design the "unreachable" parts so that there are actually 2 or more ways to reach them, one is longer & slower and is there only for the "noobs" (reachable while jumping with a weapon) and the other route is the quick one reachable with methods such as self boosting for the better players.

That's a common way of doing it, and a really good one at that, however I do think that having parts of a map accessible by only sword jumps should be fine as well.


One point I just thought of though, is that if the rule is removed you still shouldn't "over-do" the amount of sword jumps required to get around the map. In combat, it is advantageous to have your gun out, and so putting it away to sword jump is a disadvantage that could **theoretically** make something on the map unfair.
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